One of the common arguments for maintaining the closed registry system is that as soon as one does an outcross it will be impossible to breed back to the original phenotype.
This is actually not true, and with dogs, it does not take many generations to breed back before the dog looks and behaves exactly like the purebred.
I have already mentioned a nineteenth century program that introduced bloodhound into the British basset hound population to save it from an inbreeding depression. I have also mentioned Bruce Cattanach’s bobtailed boxer program, which used a naturally bobtailed corgi to introduce the trait into the boxer. In both cases, the dogs were able to return to their original type through relatively few generations of breeding back into the boxer gene pool.
Cattanach writes about how quickly he could breed dogs that looked very much like pure boxers:
The transformation in one generation can only be described as amazing. It suggests that very few genes are responsible for the main features distinguishing the Corgi and Boxer, except for the special Boxer head. The white coat colour, of course, was Boxer white and resulted from the doubling up on Boxer.
That’s right. Just a few genes separate all of these dogs breeds. Variation on only a single gene explains most of the wide variance in size among dogs. Size is very easily selected for in breeding programs, which is why we have three widely varying sizes of poodle that all descend from essentially the same stock.
If a breed has a particularly specialized head, it may take few more generations to “fix.” The bull terrier in Britain was traditionally a white dog. After all, it was derived from the English white terrier. The English white terrier went extinct because it developed severe genetic genetic problems– among them deafness. Deafness also affected the white bull terrier breed, and it was feared that it would follow its white terrier ancestor into oblivion if something was not done to correct it. The English white terrier was extinct by 1900, and within just a few years of its extinction, crosses between bull terriers and a few select Staffordshire bull terriers occurred. One of the staffies used in the program was a first cross between a bull dog and a Manchester terrier.
Although it was easy to return to the bull terrier phenotype, it was very hard to breed the special bull terrier head in the colored lines. Bull terriers have a very specialized, egg-shaped head, and they also have triangular eyes, which were very hard to fix in the colored lines. The prevalence of “button eyes” in colored strains led some fanciers to denounce them as mongrel, and it is one of the reasons why the AKC has two separate varieties of bull terrier: white and colored.
However, even those button-eyed coloreds looked very much like bull terriers. Perhaps if the bull terrier fanciers had been more open to breeding from them, they would have become more or less like the white dogs much more quickly.
But through backcrossing and selective breeding, the colored bull terriers now have classic bull terrier conformation. One even won best in show at Westminster in 2006.
Simply put, the argument that it is impossible to breed back traits after doing an outcross is simply bogus. The fact that it takes just a few generations of backcrossing to produce a dog that is virtually identical to the backcrossed breed shows how easy it is.
Albert Payson Terhune evidently knew of this fact when wrote the story of a collie named Buff. Nina, Buff’s mother, was an accidental cross between a collie and pit bull, and she accidentally mated with a top show collie. Buff resembled a perfect show collie, even though his grandsire had been a pit bull.
There actually was a collie named Buff. His photo appears in the frontispiece of the book, but I do not think that this collie actually had this ancestry. It is possible, but I doubt it.
The rapid effects of backcrossing in dogs have been well-established for quite some time. Stonehenge (John Henry Walsh) was quite aware of how easy it was to return to phenotype after just a few generations of backcrossing. He used an experimental crossbreeding between a bulldog and a greyhound. Writing about this crossbreeding and back crossing program in his The Dog in Health and Disease (1859), Stonehenge points out how quickly it easy to produce dogs that resemble greyhound from backcrossing:
It might naturally be supposed by any person who has not been convinced to the contrary, that it would take several crosses to get rid of the heavy form of the bulldog when united with the light and graceful shape of the greyhound. But on actually trying the experiment it will readily be seen that in the third generation very little trace remains of the bulldog, while in the fourth there is none whatever apparent in external form. My friend Mr. Hanley is the last who has tried the experiment, and having kept a daguerreotype of every individual used in it, which he has kindly placed at my service, I have been enabled to present to my readers perfectly trustworthy proofs of the correctness of this assertion. The bulldog “Chicken” used was a very high-bred animal, and of him also Mr. Hanley has preserved a daguerreotype, but as his blood is very similar to that of Mr. Stockdale’s “Top,” I have not thought it necessary to engrave him. The bitch “Fly,” put to “Chicken,” was also highly bred (pg. 179).
One must note that Stonehenge writes that Chicken was nearly identical to a bulldog named Top, which he depicts in his section on bulldogs. The first cross between Chicken and Fly, called a “Half- and-Half,” is a meld of features from the greyhound and this old type of bulldog:
The “Half-and-Half” was then bred to a greyhound named Blunder, and this breeding produced a white bitch named Hecate:
Stonehenge describes Hecate:
From these came the second cross, “Hecate,” a white bitch still presenting some slight characteristics of the bulldog breed, but by an ordinary observer this would be scarcely noticed. There is, however, a remarkable want of symmetry and true proportion in this bitch, which the portrait conveys exactly (pg. 181-182)
Hecate may not have been what greyhound fanciers wanted in an ideal specimen, but she doesn’t look all that much like a bulldog. She just looks like an “off” greyhound.
Hecate was bred to another greyhound named Preston. He was a very fast dog, and it was thought that he would pass on these traits to his offspring. One of the puppies produced from that breeding was a black bitch named Hecuba:
Stonehenge describes Hecuba as “a large black bitch of good shape, and, as I before remarked scarcely distinguishable from the pure greyhound” (182-183).
She was a very fast dog, but she lacked stamina. This finding suggests that certain working characteristics might be hard to breed back through backcrossing when the original outcross is between two very different breeds.
Hecuba was bred to another greyhound named Bedlamite, and the offspring that resulted from this litter were fast but were deficient in “stoutness.” Stonehenge shows a depiction of one of these dogs. Her name is Hysterics, and she is very clearly a greyhound.
Hysterics was then bred to Ranter, her full greyhound half brother, and the puppies that resulted from that breeding were not as good as the fourth cross. Perhaps such tight breeding caused these deficiencies.
So even in Stonehenge’s day, it was well-known among dog fanciers that it didn’t take many generations of backcrossing from an outcross to produce dogs that had the correct phenotype.
And in Stonehenge’s day, Gregor Mendel’s work was not yet accepted as science. Although Mendel was conducting his experiments at the time of Stonehenge’s writing, his work was essentially unknown to the British public.
Now, we have a much more complete understanding of genetics. It is not complete by any means, but we know how many traits are inherited dogs. Because we have this knowledge, it will be easier for us to engage in cross-breeding and backcrossing programs. We also know how to test for many genetic diseases, and we can test both breeds used in these programs for certain inherited diseases.
We know so much more than they did, and we could use crossbreeding and backcrossing programs to improve the health and diversity of many breeds.
However, institutionally, there are many barriers to these programs. The Dalmatian Backcross Project has produced Dalmatians with low uric acid concentration in their urine. Uric acid stones are major problem in the breed, so it was decided to make a cross with a pointer and then backcross to produce Dalmatians that have low uric acid concentration. After generations of backcrossing, these dogs are now 99.7 percent Dalmatian.
But the AKC and the Dalmatian Club of America have been resistant to allowing these dogs to be registered. The AKC recently deferred the decision to include these dogs to the Dalmatian Club of America. The DCA still refuses to accept them. The DCA has also started a propaganda campaign in its own literature, claiming that if such dogs are allowed in, the Dalmatian will no longer be purebred and the health of the breed will deteriorate.
All of these things are unlikely to happen, and if a dog has an old pointer ancestor but still looks and behaves like a Dalmatian, what difference does it make? The average dog owner might want a dog that looks like a Dalmatian and acts like one, but they also want one that is healthy. I don’t see what the big deal is– unless purity is such an overarching virtue that one “bastardization” several generations back negates the validity whole strain. Such a position is actually quite hard to defend to the average person looking for a dog, and this might not be the best public relations step to take.
Backcrossing allows the breeder an opportunity to return to phenotype and working ability. It allows those genes to return to the bloodline, which also has the genes from the outcrossed breed. If those genes add something to dog– such as a healthy urinary tract or a naturally bobbed tail– then these outcrossing projects are worthwhile endeavors.
Because of the successes of these sorts of programs, the dog world should be more willing to operate with an appendix registry system. As we saw with the greyhound/bulldog project, not every dog produced was worthy of breeding– as is the case with purebreds. An appendix registry allows dogs that meet some of the breed requirements to be registered, and then these animals can be bred to the other dogs in the registry. When puppies are born, they are also checked to see if they fit the criteria and are registered accordingly.
The cat fancy has totally embraced the crossbreeding and backcrossing of many different breeds. The CFA allows certain breeds– such as Persians and Exotic shorthairs– to be crossbred. These two cats have very similar conformation, just one is long-haired and the other is short-haired. The animals are crossed and registered according to phenotype– something that was done in retrievers and spaniels for decades. Cat fanciers are given a greater opportunity to selectively breed from diverse bloodlines than dog fanciers typically are.
Crossbreeding and backcrossing are tools that should be open to more dog breeders. They are tools that do require skill to use properly, but the skills can be learned. They require understanding the genetics of what makes up a particular breed or variety and that of the outcrossed breed. This sounds very scary to many traditionalists within the dog fancy. It needn’t be.
In the nineteenth century, they were doing these crossbreeding experiments with no real knowledge about health or genetics.
And the dogs didn’t fall apart.
We know so much more now. And it is time we get a chance to put that knowledge to work to build a better future for Canis lupus familiaris.











LIES! ALL LIES! Cross-breeding and back-crossing will cause dogs to EXPLODE!
A very good explanation of back-crossing. However, one should keep in mind the fact that back-crossing as described depends very much on having a “pure” line that can be used as the back-cross. The bulldog – greyhound cross was done more than once (the eccentric Lord Orford did it as well, apparently) but along very similar lines.
The point being, if one allows multiple cross-breedings (to different breeds/types) in the base breed, which could happen without very careful regulation of out-crosses, subsequent generations could turn up with all sorts of unexpected qualities.
I don’t think finding pure (i.e. homozygous) enough lines would be a problem for most breeds today.
At present, that is correct, precisely because the registries for most breeds have been closed for some time. However, if registries were to be opened without some type of control, including positive identification of all dogs entered, the situation could easily become chaotic.
If cross-breeding is to be done, the boxer and Dalmatian prototypes are good examples. They were soundly based and carried out with full disclosure. Later breeders then had the choice to use, or not use, the descendants of those dogs. In spite of the intransigence of the Dalmatian Club in this country, other registries such as the Kennel Club in the UK have recognized the descendants of the back-cross dogs.
Thing is, I don’t believe anyone who is in favor of opening stud books wants ‘chaotic crossbreeding’ going on. Pretty much everyone who ever brings it up is motivated by a desire to help a specific pure breed, and not because they want to turn it into a generic ‘pariah dog’ type.
The fact of the matter is, if someone DID want to create purpose-bred pariah dogs, they could easily do it today with no problem whatsoever. Plenty of BYBs do it every day, in fact.
The simple fact that people care about opening (rather than getting rid of) prethe stud books at all precisely is because they are invested in -preserving- a pure breed, not for creating chaos. The ‘chaos’ fear is not based on any reality, I have to say, because nobody would force anyone to breed anything they didn’t want to. Nobody holds a gun to cat breeders’ heads to outcross if they don’t want to — but if they ever DO, there is a framework and approved selection of outcross breeds they can choose from, and the offspring can be registered and show based on phenotypic/temperamental correctness.
Why dog people always seem to be afraid of that kind of system never ceases to confuse me.
There are purpose-bred “pariah dogs.’ They are called Alaskan huskies, and they have have little bit of everything in them.
I don’t consider dogs bred for a specific work to be pariahs (or mutts), but perhaps technically they fall into that category. But then, I’ve developed a much looser personal concept of what makes a ‘breed’ in recent years.
Over time, breeding different strains and selecting for working ability will result in a particular landrace. The curs, feists, and St. John’s water dogs are very good examples of this.
Some people think border collies are, but border collies are a definite breed and their registry isn’t that open.
There isn’t another herding breed that displays the behavior patterns similar to a BC’s, is there? But theoretically, if you outcrossed to another style of herding dog, then back to BCs, couldn’t that work like physical conformation in that it would come back to the BC ‘standard’?
Yes, behavioral conformation works the same way as physical conformation. The behaviors of the dogs are selectively bred for, just like conformation is selectively bred for.
However, you are never going to get a ton of people who choose to outcross to another breed. In breeds with a working/show split, you don’t see a lot of people crossing the streams, even when the dogs are starting to have problems. The reasons for this are many, including sociopolitical reasons, but the biggee is very simple: no patience. You are not going to get instant gratification through crossing, whether it is between working and show lines, or between breeds. You will need to backcross, and you will need to keep more than one or two puppies to choose from for that backcross. You may get dogs with the right behaviors, and the wrong look, the genes may nick wrong and you’ll get a whole litter that is useless, you may not get what you want out of the backcross and have to try another one. It’s much harder and it takes much longer than breeding two dogs of the same breed where you know pretty much what you are going to get.
What I said was about opening the registry “without some kind of control…”. It appears that the cat registries have instituted that control (although I’m not familiar with the details).
One of the fears about allowing at-will cross-breeding, is not from the knowledgeable breeders, but (for instance) the progeny of those cross-breedings that may fall into the hands of naive/novice breeders (or those who produce mainly in order to sell dogs). They may not know, or care, about the ancestry of the dog in hand, only that it is breedable….and you can guess where that scenario may go….
Don’t we see this behavior in the people who breed commercially already? We now call it designer dogs and the only designs the people have is on the money of the naive and gullible.
I haven’t seen anyone advocating ‘at-will’ cross-breeding. ANYONE. ANYWHERE. And I am frankly sick and tired of these bullshit arguments that come up EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. cross-breeding is mentioned. There are many other species that have appendix registries, and there are even dog breeds (gasp!) that have appendix registries.
The bullshit in regards to cross-breeding has become so ridiculous, that an intelligent discussion CANNOT BE HAD. PERIOD. Even mentioning the word makes otherwise seemingly intelligent people disconnect their brains.
Done here. Bored now.
I have not said that I am unreservedly against the possibility of cross-breeding and the back-crossing with a well-thought out plan in mind. Similar to the inter-breeding and cross-breeding that was allowed, under certain ciircumstances, by the Kennel Club in Great Britain; or the Boxer and Dalmation outcrosses that have been mentioned.
However, the discussion of cross-breeding etc so far has not actually mentioned that sort of control. Possibly it was just taken for granted, assuming readers would have that understanding. But without so stating, the discussion becomes unclear; which is why I brought up the point.
Back when the bulldog/greyhound crosses and backcrosses were done, breeders were pretty much free to do as they pleased, then register whichever dogs they decided to. Things are a bit different today.
I would support opening the registries even if you couldn’t get the same phenotype.
What you are talking about with the crossing of greyhounds and pits is called “grading up” in livestock.
[...] Those of us in the dog world who support the free and open application of outcross breedings within a registry system have previously looked to the work of Dr. Bruce Cattanach’s natural bobtail boxer program with interest. Along with the LUA Dalmatian project, it served as a go-to example of a practical out cross with good documentation that could quell the fears of the Pure-Blood-Brigade™ regarding instant and permanent breed ruination should someone anywhere breed two dogs that weren’t pedigreed in the same breed. It still stands as an excellent example of how quickly you can restore breed type even with an extreme outcross. [...]